From owner-chemistry@ccl.net Thu Apr 3 08:16:00 2014 From: "ajay mr mr.ajay.mr/./gmail.com" To: CCL Subject: CCL: Electrostatic potential vs Electrostatic potential mapping Message-Id: <-49889-140403023709-9833-F5J5nz2XhaVy5a71LFwYFQ a server.ccl.net> X-Original-From: ajay mr Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1133316edecf6e04f61d8673 Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2014 11:59:24 +0530 MIME-Version: 1.0 Sent to CCL by: ajay mr [mr.ajay.mr : gmail.com] --001a1133316edecf6e04f61d8673 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Dear Prof. Alan Shusterman, I highly appreciate your time and support. your reply very much helped me to understand some of the critical aspects of ESP. Thank you for the help. Please let me ask one more doubt. Is there any issues related to the ESP plots of aromatic molecules (say, Benzene) having an anionic or cationic substituent? As an example, Phosphonium-Benzene is a cationic system. Can we plot the ESPs of this system without considering the counter ion (say, bromide)? Thanking you Dr. M. R. Ajayakumar School of Physical Sciences Jawaharlal Nehru University New Delhi - 110 067 https://sites.google.com/site/mrajayakumarjnu/home http://www.jnu.ac.in/Faculty/pritam/home.html On Sun, Mar 30, 2014 at 2:11 AM, Alan Shusterman alan%x%reed.edu < owner-chemistry*ccl.net> wrote: > > Sent to CCL by: Alan Shusterman [alan],[reed.edu] > Dear Dr. Ajayakumar, > > I believe your question 1) is asking about the difference between an > electrostatic potential *isosurface* and an electrostatic potential *map*. > > Because the electrostatic potential varies from one point in space to the > next, there are many ways to present information about potentials. An > isosurface shows points at which the potential is the same. A map shows how > the potential varies across some arbitrarily chosen surface. > > If this is confusing, consider this analogy. Temperature, like potential, > varies with position. If we measure the temperatures around a pot of > boiling water, we could show our results by choosing one temperature value > (say 30C) and showing all of the points in space where our thermometer > reads this temperature (probably these would be points far away from the > pot). This would be a temperature isosurface. Or, we could define an > arbitrary surface (say the surface of the pot or the pot's lid), and ask > how the temperature varies on this surface. There would be a range of > temperatures on this surface and we would use a colored map to show the > variation in temperature. > > Turning to question 2), there are several numbers that are used to > describe these two types of images. > For an isosurface, you need to say what value of the potential was chosen. > Returning to my analogy, a 60C isosurface would be much more compact and > located closer to the boiling water than a 30C isosurface, so the > temperature would need to be provided. > For a map, you need to say how the surface was chosen (a common choice is > to use a surface where the electron density = 0.002 au) and then provide a > legend for translating potentials into map colors. Many potentials provide > only the extreme values of the legend and not the intermediate values. So > when you see a range like -1.24 to +1.24, this is saying that potentials > that are <= -1.24 are assigned a color at one extreme (often red) and > potentials >= +1.24 are assigned a color at the other extreme (often dark > blue). The extreme values, though, don't tell you how to interpret other > colors. > > As for 3) it is usually a good idea to use the same potential-to-color > mapping for all of your maps. There is no standard way to do this, but here > are two choices to consider for comparing two D-A systems. > Choice #1 - adjust the colors so that the full range of potentials in the > *more polar* DA system can be observed (that is, no potentials fall outside > the color range). Applying this same mapping for the *less polar* DA system > will create a map with fewer colors and the colors will be dominated by the > middle of the potential-to-color legend (often green). > Choice #2 - adjust the colors so that the full range of potentials in the > *less polar* DA system can be observed. Now the colors on both maps will > span the full color spectrum, but the *more polar* DA system can still be > identified because it will have larger regions colored with the extreme > colors (large red and/or dark blue?). > > 4) I use Spartan (www.wavefun.com). It's very easy to learn and use. It > is not free, but there are a variety of packages with different prices > > Best wishes, > Alan > > On 3/28/14 11:57 PM, ajay mr mr.ajay.mr- -gmail.com wrote: > >> Dear CCL subscribers, >> >> I was confused for a long time about the representation/visualization of >> electrostatic potential (ESP) surface (or mapping). In many litterateurs I >> saw the authors are describing the electron density differences of various >> motifs in an aromatic molecule, say, donor- acceptor (D-A) kind of >> molecule. Using this surface plots they could easily establish the >> electronic nature similar kind of systems (a class of D-A molecules). >> >> My doubts are, >> 1) Difference between Electrostatic potential and electrostatic potential >> mapping?? >> 2) What is the significance of the scale of the surface plots (e.g. -1.24 >> to +1.24 eV)?? >> 3) If I want to compare a set of similar D-A systems, whether I plot all >> the ESP mapped figures in a same scale? >> 4) Which are the best softwares (apart from GaussView) for ESP surface >> plots (preferably freewares)? >> >> Looking for your kind support. >> >> Thanking you, >> >> Dr. M. R. Ajayakumar >> School of Physical Sciences >> Jawaharlal Nehru University >> New Delhi - 110 067 >> https://sites.google.com/site/mrajayakumarjnu/home >> http://www.jnu.ac.in/Faculty/pritam/home.htmlDear subscribers, >> >> > -- > Alan Shusterman > Chemistry Department > Reed College > 3203 SE Woodstock Blvd. > Portland, OR 97202-8199 > 503-517-7699 > http://blogs.reed.edu/alan/ > "Nature doesn't make long speeches." Lao Tzu 23http://www.ccl.net/chemistry/sub_unsub.shtmlConferences: http://server.ccl.net/ > chemistry/announcements/conferences/> > > --001a1133316edecf6e04f61d8673 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear Prof. Alan Shusterman,

I highly appreciate you= r time and support. your reply very much helped me to understand some of th= e critical aspects of ESP. Thank you for the help. Please let me ask one mo= re doubt. Is there any issues=20 related to the ESP plots of aromatic molecules (say, Benzene) having an=20 anionic or cationic substituent? As an example, Phosphonium-Benzene is a cationic system. Can we plot the ESPs of this system without=20 considering the counter ion (say, bromide)?

Thanking you

Dr. M. R. Ajaya= kumar
School of Physical Sciences
Jawaharlal Nehru Univ= ersity
New Delhi - 110 067


On Sun, Mar 30, 2014 at 2:11 AM, Alan Sh= usterman alan%x%reed.edu = <owner-chem= istry*ccl.net> wrote:

Sent to CCL by: Alan Shusterman [alan],[reed.edu]
Dear Dr. Ajayakumar,

I believe your question 1) is asking about the difference between an electr= ostatic potential *isosurface* and an electrostatic potential *map*.

Because the electrostatic potential varies from one point in space to the n= ext, there are many ways to present information about potentials. An isosur= face shows points at which the potential is the same. A map shows how the p= otential varies across some arbitrarily chosen surface.

If this is confusing, consider this analogy. Temperature, like potential, v= aries with position. If we measure the temperatures around a pot of boiling= water, we could show our results by choosing one temperature value (say 30= C) and showing all of the points in space where our thermometer reads this = temperature (probably these would be points far away from the pot). This wo= uld be a temperature isosurface. Or, we could define an arbitrary surface (= say the surface of the pot or the pot's lid), and ask how the temperatu= re varies on this surface. There would be a range of temperatures on this s= urface and we would use a colored map to show the variation in temperature.=

Turning to question 2), there are several numbers that are used to describe= these two types of images.
For an isosurface, you need to say what value of the potential was chosen. = Returning to my analogy, a 60C isosurface would be much more compact and lo= cated closer to the boiling water than a 30C isosurface, so the temperature= would need to be provided.
For a map, you need to say how the surface was chosen (a common choice is t= o use a surface where the electron density =3D 0.002 au) and then provide a= legend for translating potentials into map colors. Many potentials provide= only the extreme values of the legend and not the intermediate values. So = when you see a range like -1.24 to +1.24, this is saying that potentials th= at are <=3D -1.24 are assigned a color at one extreme (often red) and po= tentials >=3D +1.24 are assigned a color at the other extreme (often dar= k blue). The extreme values, though, don't tell you how to interpret ot= her colors.

As for 3) it is usually a good idea to use the same potential-to-color mapp= ing for all of your maps. There is no standard way to do this, but here are= two choices to consider for comparing two D-A systems.
Choice #1 - adjust the colors so that the full range of potentials in the *= more polar* DA system can be observed (that is, no potentials fall outside = the color range). Applying this same mapping for the *less polar* DA system= will create a map with fewer colors and the colors will be dominated by th= e middle of the potential-to-color legend (often green).
Choice #2 - adjust the colors so that the full range of potentials in the *= less polar* DA system can be observed. Now the colors on both maps will spa= n the full color spectrum, but the *more polar* DA system can still be iden= tified because it will have larger regions colored with the extreme colors = (large red and/or dark blue?).

4) I use Spartan (www.= wavefun.com). It's very easy to learn and use. It is not free, but = there are a variety of packages with different prices

Best wishes,
Alan

On 3/28/14 11:57 PM, ajay mr mr.ajay.mr- -gmail.com wrote:
Dear CCL subscribers,

I was confused for a long time about the representation/visualization of el= ectrostatic potential (ESP) surface (or mapping). In many litterateurs I sa= w the authors are describing the electron density differences of various mo= tifs in an aromatic molecule, say, donor- acceptor (D-A) kind of molecule. = Using this surface plots they could easily establish the electronic nature = similar kind of systems (a class of D-A molecules).

My doubts are,
1) Difference between Electrostatic potential and electrostatic potential m= apping??
2) What is the significance of the scale of the surface plots (e.g. -1.24 t= o +1.24 eV)??
3) If I want to compare a set of similar D-A systems, whether I plot all th= e ESP mapped figures in a same scale?
4) Which are the best softwares (apart from GaussView) for ESP surface plot= s (preferably freewares)?

Looking for your kind support.

Thanking you,

Dr. M. R. Ajayakumar
School of Physical Sciences
Jawaharlal Nehru University
New Delhi - 110 067
https://sites.google.com/site/mrajayakumarjnu/home
http://www.jnu.ac.in/Faculty/pritam/home.htmlDear subscribe= rs,


--
Alan Shusterman
Chemistry Department
Reed College
3203 SE Woodstock Blvd.
Portland, OR 97202-8199
503-5= 17-7699
http://blogs.reed= .edu/alan/
"Nature doesn't make long speeches." Lao Tzu 23



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--001a1133316edecf6e04f61d8673-- From owner-chemistry@ccl.net Thu Apr 3 08:50:00 2014 From: "Nuno Alexandre Guerreiro Bandeira nuno.bandeira[]ist.utl.pt" To: CCL Subject: CCL: starred lone pair Message-Id: <-49890-140403070425-14347-OMuyR+lFp6OE9yUpBLAFpA=-=server.ccl.net> X-Original-From: Nuno Alexandre Guerreiro Bandeira Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_19fbeac6a2fcdb2ca47fcc279be06872" Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2014 11:04:17 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Sent to CCL by: Nuno Alexandre Guerreiro Bandeira [nuno.bandeira[A]ist.utl.pt] --=_19fbeac6a2fcdb2ca47fcc279be06872 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 It's a lone pair derived from the natural Lewis structure with an occupation less than one. In which case calling it an "lone pair" is something of an overstatement, so NBO marks it as LP*. > Friends, I found some lone pair in NBO analysis with the mark star. What it refers? Waiting for answer. > > -- > Dr. Partha Sarathi Sengupta > Associate Professor > Vivekananda Mahavidyalaya, Burdwan Regards, Nuno --=_19fbeac6a2fcdb2ca47fcc279be06872 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8

 

It's a lone pair derived from the natural Lewis structure with an occupa= tion less than one.

In which case calling it an "lone pair" is something of an overstatement= , so NBO marks it as LP*.

 

Friends, I found some lone pair in NBO analysis with the mark star. What it refers?
Waiting for answer.

--
Dr. Partha Sarathi Sengupta
Associate Professor Vivekananda Mahavidyalaya, Burdwan

 

Regards,

Nuno

 
--=_19fbeac6a2fcdb2ca47fcc279be06872-- From owner-chemistry@ccl.net Thu Apr 3 12:26:00 2014 From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?V=EDctor_Lua=F1a?= Cabal victor:fluor.quimica.uniovi.es" To: CCL Subject: CCL: Electrostatic potential vs Electrostatic potential mapping Message-Id: <-49891-140403093805-15286-MRROhva5d7CEKizadbssPw|*|server.ccl.net> X-Original-From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=EDctor_Lua=F1a?= Cabal Content-disposition: inline Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2014 14:37:48 +0200 MIME-version: 1.0 Sent to CCL by: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=EDctor_Lua=F1a?= Cabal [victor]~[fluor.quimica.uniovi.es] On Thu, Apr 03, 2014 at 11:59:24AM +0530, ajay mr mr.ajay.mr/./gmail.com wrote: > Dear Prof. Alan Shusterman, > > I highly appreciate your time and support. your reply very much helped me > to understand some of the critical aspects of ESP. Thank you for the help. > Please let me ask one more doubt. Is there any issues related to the ESP > plots of aromatic molecules (say, Benzene) having an anionic or cationic > substituent? As an example, Phosphonium-Benzene is a cationic system. Can > we plot the ESPs of this system without considering the counter ion (say, > bromide)? > > Dr. M. R. Ajayakumar > School of Physical Sciences > Jawaharlal Nehru University > New Delhi - 110 067 > https://sites.google.com/site/mrajayakumarjnu/home > http://www.jnu.ac.in/Faculty/pritam/home.html Dr, Ajayakumar, Take control of your mental instruments. You can use gnuplot to print any model you imagine. You can use GNU-octave or python to adapt any data set to explore any thing you are interested in. There are equivalent tools to print a beautiful 3D image with textures in the surfaces, transparency, etc. Free software * in all cases. (*) free as in freedom, usualy but not in all cases free as in free-beer If the question is : Is there a GUI interface to do the nice plot with my smallest capacity of decision? Then wait for the answer. Sorry for entering in this conversation between Prof. Alan Shusterman and you, but this is a public channel. Take this as a my 2 cents contribution. Best regards, Dr. Víctor Luaña -- \|/ |^.^| +---!OO--\_/--OO!------------------------------+----------------------- ! Dr.Víctor Luaña ! ! Departamento de Química Física y Analítica ! ! Quantum chemistry hroup ! ! Universidad de Oviedo, 33006-Oviedo, Spain ! ! e-mail: victor^fluor.quimica.uniovi.es ! ! phone: +34-985-103491 fax: +34-985-103125 ! +----------------------------------------------+ GroupPage : http://azufre.quimica.uniovi.es/ (being reworked) Instititional email: (don't use it, please)