From Jeffrey.Gosper@brunel.ac.uk Mon Jun 9 03:47:46 1997 Received: from himiko.brunel.ac.uk for Jeffrey.Gosper@brunel.ac.uk by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id DAA28630; Mon, 9 Jun 1997 03:45:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from castjjg.brunel.ac.uk (actually chem-pc-03.brunel.ac.uk) by himiko.brunel.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 9 Jun 1997 08:44:58 +0100 Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 08:41:38 PDT From: Jeffrey Gosper Subject: Re: CCL:animation To: Chris Harwell cc: CHEMISTRY@www.ccl.net Message-ID: Priority: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On Fri, 6 Jun 1997 16:08:24 -0500 (CDT) Chris Harwell wrote: > From: Chris Harwell > Date: Fri, 6 Jun 1997 16:08:24 -0500 (CDT) > Subject: CCL:animation > To: chemistry@www.ccl.net > > Greetings netters, > > we are looking for software (preferably free or cheap) that will > > 1) draw a molecule (small < 30 atoms) or just balls for atoms are fine > > 2) animate the picture ie we specify one config in an xyz file then the > next frame in another xyz file... > > 3) AND will alow an additional parameter to be changed like color from > frame to frame. (this is to represent the change in charge with time) > > It sounds like Re_View(2) is exactly what you want. It provides complete control of atom colours, etc; enables multistructure XYZ files to be read in; displays animations and even drives POV-ray without the user having to know anything about the ray-tracing processes so that mpeg and AAplay movies are automatically generated. Best of all it runs under Window3.1/95/NT. PS: Re_View contains many more features including 'active' graphs of data, etc. Take a look at Re_View's WWW pages for details. /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ Dr. Jeff Gosper, Dept. of Chemistry, BRUNEL University Uxbridge Middx UB8 3PH, UK voice: 01895 274000 x2187, facsim: 01895 256844 internet/email/work: Jeffrey.Gosper@brunel.ac.uk internet/WWW: http://www.brunel.ac.uk/~castjjg Re_View's home page (molecular animations or Chem-4D): http://www.brunel.ac.uk/depts/chem/ch241s/re_view/re_view.htm \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ From JeffAyres@worldnet.att.net Mon Jun 9 14:47:50 1997 Received: from mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net for JeffAyres@worldnet.att.net by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id OAA01884; Mon, 9 Jun 1997 14:15:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from LOCALNAME ([207.147.168.33]) by mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA26000 for ; Mon, 9 Jun 1997 18:15:00 +0000 Message-ID: <339C48B8.6162@worldnet.att.net> Date: Mon, 09 Jun 1997 11:17:28 -0700 From: "Jeffrey J. Ayres" Organization: independent X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: chemistry@www.ccl.net Subject: Spartan and Babel Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello again, Could someone please supply me with the corrections nessecary to use BABEL to convert SPARTAN input files into PDB files? I'm using BABEL ver. 1.06. The SPARTAN input files contain approximately 230 heavy atoms. Using BABEL 1.06 without the corrections results in PDB files with only two lines, last being the master record line. Thank you, Jeff Ayres From paul@setanta.harvard.edu Mon Jun 9 21:47:55 1997 Received: from setanta.harvard.edu for paul@setanta.harvard.edu by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id VAA03364; Mon, 9 Jun 1997 21:07:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (paul@localhost) by setanta.harvard.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA00685 for ; Mon, 9 Jun 1997 20:14:30 -0400 Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 20:14:30 -0400 (EDT) From: "Paul D. Lyne" To: chemistry@www.ccl.net Subject: CURVES Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hi Could somebody please tell me where I can get a copy of the program CURVES written by Lavery and Sklenar J. Biomol. Struct. & Dyn., 1988,6,63-91. It analyses the structures of nucleic acid molecules. Thanks Paul --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr. Paul D. Lyne, Department of Chemistry, Tel: (617) 495 1775 Harvard University, Fax: (617) 496 3204 12 Oxford Street, Email: paul@tammy.harvard.edu Cambridge, MA 02138 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From toukie@zui.unizh.ch Mon Jun 2 02:46:15 1997 Received: from zzmkgtw.zzmk.unizh.ch for toukie@zui.unizh.ch by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id CAA19786; Mon, 2 Jun 1997 02:26:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: by zzmkgtw.zzmk.unizh.ch; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA11970; Mon, 2 Jun 1997 08:26:42 +0200 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970602062847.00664b6c@highdent.zzmk.unizh.ch> X-Sender: toukie@highdent.zzmk.unizh.ch (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 02 Jun 1997 08:28:47 +0200 To: chemistry@www.ccl.net From: "Hr. Dr. S. Shapiro" Subject: Nomenclature question Cc: toukie@zui.unizh.ch Dear Colleagues; I have a question about the proper terminology to describe flexibility in molecules. As a case in point, consider the molecule 2-mercapto-3-isopropyl-5-methylnaphthalene. Such a molecule has five bonds where rotation can take place: C(2)-S, C(3)-CH(CH3)2, C(5)-CH3, and the two CH-CH3 bonds of the isopropyl moiety. Now, it seems to me that only two of these five possible rotations will have any significant conformational consequences, viz. C(2)-S and C(3)-CH(CH3)2. Under these circumstances, would it be correct to say that 2-mercapto-3-ispropyl-5-methylnaphthalene has "two principal degrees of conformational freedom"? If not, what short phrase would you suggest to indicate that only 2/5 possible rotations in this molecule will have any significant conformational consequences? Thanks in advance to all responders. Sincerely, S. Shapiro toukie@zui.unizh.ch From ccl@www.ccl.net Mon Jun 2 19:46:22 1997 Received: from bedrock.ccl.net for ccl@www.ccl.net by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id SAA25298; Mon, 2 Jun 1997 18:54:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from wchd18.chemie.uni-wuerzburg.de for s101264.k4.stud.uni-wuerzburg@wrzn12.rz.uni-wuerzburg.de by bedrock.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id SAA26158; Mon, 2 Jun 1997 18:54:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from claessen (wex036.extern.uni-wuerzburg.de [132.187.248.36]) by wchd18.chemie.uni-wuerzburg.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA07531 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 1997 08:27:24 +0200 Message-Id: <199706030627.IAA07531@wchd18.chemie.uni-wuerzburg.de> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Rolf Claessen" Organization: University of Wuerzburg, Dept. of Chemistry To: chemistry@ccl.net Date: Mon, 2 Jun 1997 23:21:52 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Winners of "Top 5% Chemistry Site" Award Reply-to: s101264@stud-mail.uni-wuerzburg.de Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.52) Winners of "Top 5% Chemistry Site" Award given by The Homepage for Chemists http://www-public.rz.uni-duesseldorf.de/~knecht/chempage.htm und Rolf Claessen's Chemistry Index http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/5243/home_en.htm This time 11 applicants (the top 5% of all applicants this month) received the award. Check lists of the award winners of may and april at the URLs given above. Yours sincerely, Rolf Claessen Rolf Claessen's Chemistry Index http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/5243/index.htm From hinsen@lmspc1.ibs.fr Tue Jun 3 06:46:29 1997 Received: from ibs.ibs.fr for hinsen@lmspc1.ibs.fr by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id GAA27489; Tue, 3 Jun 1997 06:17:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lmspc1.ibs.fr (hinsen@lmspc1.ibs.fr [192.134.36.141]) by ibs.ibs.fr (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA26987 for ; Tue, 3 Jun 1997 12:18:17 +0200 Received: (from hinsen@localhost) by lmspc1.ibs.fr (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA21363; Tue, 3 Jun 1997 12:17:18 +0200 Date: Tue, 3 Jun 1997 12:17:18 +0200 Message-Id: <199706031017.MAA21363@lmspc1.ibs.fr> From: Konrad Hinsen To: chemistry@www.ccl.net Subject: Update: The Molecular Modeling Toolkit, version 1.0b2 Status: RO Content-Length: 1540 [I have sent this to the list last Thursday, but it seems that it got stuck somewhere.] Update: The Molecular Modeling Toolkit, version 1.0b2 ===================================================== The Molecular Modelling Toolkit (MMTK) is a program library for molecular modelling applications. Its aim is to provide researchers, especially those working on the development of new modelling methods, with a code basis that can be easily extended and modified to deal with standard and non-standard problems in molecular modelling. MMTK is free software. The second public release, 1.0b2, adds some new features and improvements, mostly related to trajectories. With the new version, MMTK has moved. It is now at http://starship.skyport.net/crew/hinsen/mmtk.html A mailing list has been created for those who wish to discuss MMTK-related questions and be informed about new versions. To join the mailing list, send a message with the word "subscribe" (without the quotes) as the *subject* to mmtk-list-request@starship.skyport.net -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Konrad Hinsen | E-Mail: hinsen@ibs.ibs.fr Laboratoire de Dynamique Moleculaire | Tel.: +33-4.76.88.99.28 Institut de Biologie Structurale | Fax: +33-4.76.88.54.94 41, av. des Martyrs | Deutsch/Esperanto/English/ 38027 Grenoble Cedex 1, France | Nederlands/Francais ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From robert@pauli.utmb.edu Tue Jun 3 14:57:53 1997 Received: from nmr.utmb.edu for robert@pauli.utmb.edu by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id OAA00403; Tue, 3 Jun 1997 14:08:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pauli.utmb.edu by nmr.utmb.edu via SMTP (931110.SGI/930416.SGI.AUTO) for chemistry@www.ccl.net id AA01607; Tue, 3 Jun 97 13:13:05 -0600 Received: (from robert@localhost) by pauli.utmb.edu (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id NAA22386; Tue, 3 Jun 1997 13:07:38 -0500 From: "Robert Fraczkiewicz" Message-Id: <9706031307.ZM22384@pauli.utmb.edu> Date: Tue, 3 Jun 1997 13:07:38 -0500 In-Reply-To: Juan Frau "CCL:Solvation in MM" (Jun 3, 5:51pm) References: <380*dqujfm0@PS.UIB.ES> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: Juan Frau Subject: Re: CCL:Solvation in MM Cc: chemistry@www.ccl.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Dear Juan, FANTOM uses continuum solvation model based on exact accessible surface areas. Short description can be found in our poster: http://www.scsb.utmb.edu/comp_biol.html/poster1/ FANTOM home page is here: http://www.scsb.utmb.edu/fantom/ Best regards, Robert Fraczkiewicz On Jun 3, 5:51pm, Juan Frau wrote: > Subject: CCL:Solvation in MM > --=_IF2cdze1 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hi everybody > I was wondering if someone has a list of different solvatin models > used in molecular mechanics (and MC or MD) calculations. > > I am taking about explicit accountig for water molecules and > continuum models (GB/SA in Macromodel for example). > > Could you send me this information or references related to? > > I 'll summarize the reply to the list > Thanks. > > Juan Frau > --=_IF2cdze1 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > > ********************************************************************** > > Dr. Juan Frau > Universitat Illes Balears > Departament de Quimica > Crta Valldemossa, km. 7.5 > Palma de Mallorca- 07071 > Spain > > Email: dqujfm0@ps.uib.es > FAX: 34 71 17 34 26 > ********************************************************************* > --=_IF2cdze1 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > > --=_IF2cdze1-- > >-- End of excerpt from Juan Frau From ccl@www.ccl.net Wed Jun 4 05:46:42 1997 Received: from bedrock.ccl.net for ccl@www.ccl.net by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id FAA03331; Wed, 4 Jun 1997 05:46:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ibs.ibs.fr for lars@lmspc3.ibs.fr by bedrock.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id FAA03722; Wed, 4 Jun 1997 05:46:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lmspc3.ibs.fr (lars@lmspc3.ibs.fr [192.134.36.143]) by ibs.ibs.fr (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA03989 for ; Wed, 4 Jun 1997 11:47:18 +0200 Received: (from lars@localhost) by lmspc3.ibs.fr (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA15923 for CHEMISTRY@ccl.net; Wed, 4 Jun 1997 11:42:52 +0200 Date: Wed, 4 Jun 1997 11:42:52 +0200 From: Lars Hemmingsen Message-Id: <199706040942.LAA15923@lmspc3.ibs.fr> To: CHEMISTRY@ccl.net Subject: CCL: NO3-, CO3-- .... polarizabilities Hi all ! I would greatly appreciate all hints for where I may find calculated or experimentally determined polarizabilities for NO3-, CO3--, SO4-- and PO4--- ? yours Lars Hemmingsen From fgonzale@lauca.usach.cl Thu Jun 5 20:53:02 1997 Received: from ralun.usach.cl for fgonzale@lauca.usach.cl by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id UAA14352; Thu, 5 Jun 1997 20:46:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from lauca.usach.cl (lauca.usach.cl [158.170.64.28]) by ralun.usach.cl (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA14467 for ; Thu, 5 Jun 1997 20:55:21 -0500 Received: (from fgonzale@localhost) by lauca.usach.cl (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA23518; Thu, 5 Jun 1997 20:49:47 -0400 Date: Thu, 5 Jun 1997 20:49:46 -0400 (CST) From: Fdo Danilo Gonzalez Nilo To: CHEMISTRY@www.ccl.net Subject: binding free energy in solution Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hi all! I want to apply the thermodinamic cycle (FEP) with MD and PBC. my question is : For calculating solvation energies how can I consider the energy that has the cell itself (just with water, without the substrate)? for instance: subst = A deltaG = [E(A(aq)) + E (water cell)] - E (A(g)) delta G A (g) -------> A (aq) for getting the true value of solvation delta G, is then necessary to correct doing a substraction of the value of a pure water cell? Thanks a lot! ************************************************************************* Fernando Danilo Gonzalez N. University of Santiago de Chile Faculty of Chemistry and Biology Casilla 40, Correo 33, Santiago, Chile fono: 681 2575 E-mail : fgonzale@lauca.usach.cl fax : (562) 681 2108 danilo@quimbio.usach.cl URL : http://quimbio.usach.cl/~danilo/ *************************************************************************x From robert@pauli.utmb.edu Fri Jun 6 10:47:13 1997 Received: from nmr.utmb.edu for robert@pauli.utmb.edu by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id JAA17129; Fri, 6 Jun 1997 09:54:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pauli.utmb.edu by nmr.utmb.edu via SMTP (931110.SGI/930416.SGI.AUTO) for chemistry@www.ccl.net id AA09710; Fri, 6 Jun 97 08:59:07 -0600 Received: (from robert@localhost) by pauli.utmb.edu (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id IAA28776; Fri, 6 Jun 1997 08:53:24 -0500 From: "Robert Fraczkiewicz" Message-Id: <9706060853.ZM28774@pauli.utmb.edu> Date: Fri, 6 Jun 1997 08:53:24 -0500 In-Reply-To: Ahmed Bouferguene "CCL:Software to draw curves..." (Jun 5, 7:00pm) References: X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: Ahmed Bouferguene , chemistry@www.ccl.net Subject: Re: CCL:Software to draw curves... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On Jun 5, 7:00pm, Ahmed Bouferguene wrote: > Subject: CCL:Software to draw curves... > > Hi netters, > > I wonder if somebody knows a site from which one can dowload (for > free) a software drawing curves, functions (given by their explicit > forms), etc... > > Thanks a lot. Ahmed, May I suggest ACEGr (a.k.a. xmgr): an excellent drawing tool by Paul J. Turner for X/Motif workstations. Available at: ftp://ftp.teleport.com/pub/users/pturner/acegr/xmgr-3.01pl7.tar.gz Happy drawing, Robert Fraczkiewicz University of Texas Medical Branch Galveston, TX 77555 From ccl@www.ccl.net Fri Jun 6 13:00:25 1997 Received: from bedrock.ccl.net for ccl@www.ccl.net by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id MAA17921; Fri, 6 Jun 1997 12:12:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rrzs2.rz.uni-regensburg.de for herbert.homeier@chemie.uni-regensburg.de by bedrock.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id MAA15284; Fri, 6 Jun 1997 12:12:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rchs1.chemie.uni-regensburg.de (rchs1.chemie.uni-regensburg.de [132.199.48.1]) by rrzs2.rz.uni-regensburg.de (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA21059; Fri, 6 Jun 1997 18:11:33 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by rchs1.chemie.uni-regensburg.de (4.1/URRZ-sub (1.5)) id AA01719; Fri, 6 Jun 97 19:08:37 +0200 Date: Fri, 6 Jun 97 19:08:37 +0200 From: Herbert Homeier t4720 Message-Id: <9706061708.AA01719@rchs1.chemie.uni-regensburg.de> To: Chemistry@ccl.net Subject: Computer Physics Program Library on WWW Cc: cpc@qub.ac.uk Reply-To: cpc@qub.ac.uk Hi all, it may be of interest to you that the CPC program library provides a very nice interface to WWW. The URL is http://www.cpc.cs.qub.ac.uk/cpc/ Best regards Herbert Homeier -- Priv.-Doz. Dr. Herbert H. H. Homeier Institut fuer Physikalische und Theoretische Chemie Universitaet Regensburg, D-93040 Regensburg, Germany Phone: +49-941-943 4720 FAX: +49-941-943 4719/+49-941-943 2305 email: herbert.homeier@na-net.ornl.gov WWW: http://www.chemie.uni-regensburg.de/~hoh05008 From shenkin@still3.chem.columbia.edu Fri Jun 6 13:47:13 1997 Received: from mailrelay1.cc.columbia.edu for shenkin@still3.chem.columbia.edu by www.ccl.net (8.8.3/950822.1) id MAA18159; Fri, 6 Jun 1997 12:59:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from still3.chem.columbia.edu (still3.chem.columbia.edu [128.59.112.36]) by mailrelay1.cc.columbia.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA16381; Fri, 6 Jun 1997 12:59:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: by still3.chem.columbia.edu (950413.SGI.8.6.12/930416.SGI.AUTO) id MAA03925; Fri, 6 Jun 1997 12:59:14 -0400 Date: Fri, 6 Jun 1997 12:59:14 -0400 From: shenkin@still3.chem.columbia.edu (Peter Shenkin) Message-Id: <199706061659.MAA03925@still3.chem.columbia.edu> To: CHEMISTRY@www.ccl.net Subject: Results of RTFM straw poll Cc: mmod@still3.chem.columbia.edu Last week I posted to CCL a query concerning whether distribution of hardcopy documentation with complicated software packages, like MacroModel or Gaussian, in necessary. Twenty-seven individuals responded, some to CCL and some by personal email. I promised to post a summary, and this is it. The question I was trying to ask was: 1. Is it necessary for providers of complicated programs such as MacroModel (or Gaussian) to supply hard-copy manuals? Unfortunately, I didn't state it quite as unambiguously as this, and although some people addressed this question, others addressed other, related questions -- sometimes instead of, sometimes in addition to the above. The other question that was addressed frequently enough to justify the tallying of results was: 2. Is it necessary for providers of complicated programs such as MacroModel (or Gaussian) to supply printable (not necessarily hard-copy) manuals. As I sometimes clarified in email with respondants, I distinguish a "printable manual" from on-line documentation (such as HTML) in that the manual has page numbers, an index, a table of contents, and (usually) a "nice" page layout. Since I didn't originally set the questions out as straightforwardly as above, I had to decide, when reading a response, how to tally it, if at all. Someone else might have tallied the results slightly differently (though, I'd guess, not very differently). I decided to view (1) as a stronger version of (2): (2) asks about printable documentation, but an affirmative answer to (1) means that not only should there be printable manuals, but that, in addition, an actual printed copy should be provided. Thus, I tallied a "Yes" for (1) as a "Yes" for (2) as well; similarly, I tallied a "No" for (2) as a "No" for (1): if one need not supply even printable manuals, actual printed manuals cannot be necessary. I feel the comments made in the responses justify this interpretation. Poll Results: Necessary Unnecessary 1. Hard-copy manuals: 8 9 2. Printable manuals: 19 6 Summary: More people addressed the question I wasn't trying to ask (2) than the one I was trying to ask (1). But, of those who addressed each, about 80% think printable manuals are necessary, but only half think that software vendors need supply actual hard copy. Some rationales expressed for some of thae above views: Printed manuals (even if printed by the user) are great because you can read them on the bus (or in the toilet). Even if you don't choose to read manuals on the bus (or in the toilet) yourself, printable manuals allow those who wish to to do so. Vendor-supplied manuals are better than user-printed manuals because vendor-supplied manuals are more compact, better bound, and easier to carry around. Other opinions that were expressed on these and other issues include: Hard-copy manuals can "walk away", so on-line manuals are better. It's easier to search an on-line manual than a printed manual. It's easier to browse and annotate a printed manual than an on-line manual. Environmental considerations should preclude the printing of manuals (even by a user). PDF (Acrobat) format is the best on-line format, since it can look just like the printed manual yet be searchable and cross-referenced. PDF (Acrobat) format sucks, since if you don't have the fonts and the setup just right, which can sometimes be hard to do, you can't view the document at all. HTML, though it's limited, is so universal that everyone ought to use it for on-line documents. It would be great to have HTML docs in a form in which you could annotate them, and retain your annotations for future viewing. SGI's "Insight" books are the best form of on-line documentation in the known Universe. SGI's "Insight" books suck, and SGI should have stuck to UNIX "man" pages. Vendors should supply hard-copy manuals as an extra-cost option. My personal pre-conceptions, opinions, and post-conceptions: I started out strongly in favor of both (1) and (2). I actually do read our manuals on the bus (and our competitors' manuals in the toilet :-) ), and it's much easier to handle a more compact document. I was surprised, of course, that everybody didn't agree with me. I regard the poll results as being strongly in favor of printable manuals. I regard the poll results as indicating only a weak interest in vendor-supplied hard-copy -- based on both the paucity and the divided nature of the response to question (1). My sense is that even most of those who like to read hard-copy view user-printable manuals as a reasonable compromise. "By the way:" I went back on my promise to count the votes of MacroModel users twice. :-) Several people indicated an interest in seeing the actual responses. However, since I never asked permission to quote those who responded by email, I want to remove the attributions from the responses first. It will take me a few days to get around to this. When it's done, the full list will appear in my finger plan, so just try: finger shenkin@still3.chem.columbia.edu In about a week, this should return the actual responses. -P. **** "Deep Blue can't triumph in the game of life." (NY Times, 5/13/97) *** * Peter S. Shenkin; Chemistry, Columbia U.; 3000 Broadway, Mail Code 3153 * ** NY, NY 10027; shenkin@columbia.edu; (212)854-5143; FAX: 678-9039 *** *MacroModel WWW page: http://www.columbia.edu/cu/chemistry/mmod/mmod.html *