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From: "Dr. Martin Schuetz" <teomgs@theochem.uni-stuttgart.de>
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Date: Wed, 8 Oct 1997 11:06:01 -0600
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To: chemistry@www.ccl.net, teomgs@artemis.rus.uni-stuttgart.de
Subject: (Fwd) CCL:DFT and H2O Dimer
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>Hi CCL'ers,
>I am not d'accord with Rudolf Herrmann's statement, that DFT is
>not suitable for the water dimer, because "DFT methods are not meant
>to treat long range interactions such as van der Waals forces". The
>electrostatic part of the intermolecular interaction ist really the
>most long range part and is treated the same way in DFT as in
>conventional ab initio methods. What is really missing is Dispersion,
>which is important for the interaction of non-polar molecules like
>hydrocarbons and esp. for aromatic systems. Therefore the interactions
>in the water dimer, which are dominated by the electrostatic and
>polarization part of the interaction (i.e. H-bonds), are very well
>described by DFT methods, like BP, BLYP, B3LYP, etc. (not LDA !, but
>LDA is not DFT). On the other hand, the benzene dimer ( and of
>course all noble gas dimers ) is only poorly described by DFT methods.
>Best (!!!!) references :

DFT would lead primarily to an improvement over SCF due to introduction of
intramolecular correlation, which modifies the multipole moments of the
individual water monomers. These are "local" correlation effects and hence
treated well by DFT. However this portion of the interaction energy is
repulsive (0.3-0.4 kcal/mol according to SAPT) and therefore the
DFT interaction energy should be lower than the SCF interaction energy,
if there is no dispersion energy carried by the functionals.
In the water dimer, the dispersion energy still is of the order of 25-30 %
of the water dimer interaction energy, which although not dominant, certainly
is a non-negligible fraction of the interaction energy. If the present
functionals are not able to describe the less local dispersion forces
appropriately, one should be careful with H-bonded systems as well when using
DFT. In that sense I disagree with Dr. Schiffer, that the water dimer really is
well described with DTF with the present standard gradient corrected
functionals.
A good method to describe the water dimer and larger water clusters is
MP2, which is very close to CCSD(T) for these systems, since SD and disconneted
Q excitations cancel the connected triples to large extends.




From mkanter@cas.org  Wed Oct  8 09:29:19 1997
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From: mkanter@cas.org (mjk51)
Message-Id: <9710080828.AA6746@cas.org>
Subject: Re: CCL:CCL:New Issue of NetSci
In-Reply-To: <Pine.PMDF.3.95.970930132128.357437B-100000@DELTA.IS.TCU.EDU> of Tue, 30 Sep 1997 13:22:23 -0500 (CDT)
To: "Miguel A. Mendez Rojas" <mmendez@DELTA.IS.TCU.EDU>
Cc: Network Science <netsci@awod.com>, chemistry@www.ccl.net
Cc: mkanter@cas.org



   ATTENTION:

	     AS OF FRIDAY OCTOBER 10, 1997

	     MY NEW EMail ADDRESS IS mjk58@cas.org

				     mjk58@cas.org


			       MORTON KANTER

From schiffer@h1tw0036.hoechst.com  Wed Oct  8 09:59:49 1997
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Date: Wed, 08 Oct 1997 14:46:57 +0200
From: "Dr. Heinz Schiffer" <schiffer@h1tw0036.hoechst.com>
Organization: Hoechst Research & Technology
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Subject: Re: CCL:DFT and H2O Dimer
References: <28762.9710071105@hpf.ch.man.ac.uk>
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Hi Noj

> just a brief comment - on this comment to an earlier statement -
> i guess that one would
> generally be keen to use DFT (rather than HF say) due to its inclusion
> of correlation effects. As has also been discussed on the CCL recently the
> 'dispersion' effects are mainly driven by correlation effects
> therefore it seems to me that to say that DFT methods are 'good' for
> the water dimer
> problem because it gets most of the effects correct (except maybe
> dispersion, which should not be the main force)
> is placing too much faith in DFT - as it should really be able to deal
> with dispersion as well (if it got the correlation right).

Wrong ! There is no dispersion at all in all local (LDA) or semi-local
(i.e. so-called gradient corrected density functionals, like B, BP,
BLYP, etc.) DFT methods. See the references by Becke, Pulay, and Sprik,
which were always given on the CCL. There are some people ( like
e.g. Baerends, and some other physicists, publishing in Phys. Rev.
Lett. ) who are trying to construct an Exchange-Correlation energy
functional, which includes dispersion. But as far as I know, it is very
difficult and there are no results so far, which can be used in 
quantum chemistry.
 
> I guess my point is why not just use HF rather than DFT if its
> inclusion of correlation is not good enough to give a reasonable
> physical description of dispersion forces?

E.g., because DFT methods are far better for electrostatics than HF !
 
> p.s. i'm sure that DFT does in practice offer improvement over HF its just that
> i don't feel that Dr. Schiffer's argument explained why one should
> consider it a 'good' method for these interactions.

See above !
 
> (and i'm sure you could find the odd physicist out there who would be
> able to argue that LDA IS DFT - maybe just not 'good' DFT for chemists)

LDA is just one approximation for the exchange-correlation energy
functional ( there is also a kinetic energy part in it ! ). I was
only saying, that LDA and DFT are not synonyms.

Ciao,
Heinz
-- 
Dr. Heinz Schiffer                  Phone ++49-69-305-2330                      
Hoechst Research & Technology       Fax   ++49-69-305-81162                     
Scientific Computing, G864          Email schiffer@h1tw0036.hoechst.com         
65926 Frankfurt am Main                   Schiffer@CRT.hoechst.com

From demarche@worldnet.fr  Wed Oct  8 10:29:18 1997
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From: "cird" <demarche@worldnet.fr>
To: <CHEMISTRY@www.ccl.net>
Subject: 3D structure generator
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 1997 16:07:29 +0200
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Hi All,
	I am searching for a automatic 3D structure generator which accepts
Smiles strings. Does anyone know of any utilities available that can do
this
(other than Corina or Concord).
				thanks
				Dominique Douguet

From widauer@inorg.chem.ethz.ch  Wed Oct  8 10:33:21 1997
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Date: Wed, 08 Oct 1997 15:50:12 +0100
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Subject: symmetry break in irc 
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hello 

first of all thank you very much for the answers concerning the all
electron basis sets for as and sb. I will submit a collection of the
answers this week.

Another problem I have, concerns an irc calculation running on G94. The
vibrational mode of the negative frequency does not break the Cs molecule
symmetry (it is a protonation of a double bond system in which the proton
aproaches in the symmetry plane). However, running the irc,  the symmetry
taken from the checkpoint file turns to C1-symmetry and the calculation
terminates. Using nosymm only "solves" the problem at computational
expense. Whenever it is obvious that the symmetry changes during a reaction
it is clear that nosymm is the only solution (is it?) in order to run an
irc calculation. In this particular case I would like to know if I can
avoid nosymm.

From schiffer@h1tw0036.hoechst.com  Wed Oct  8 10:36:05 1997
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Date: Wed, 08 Oct 1997 15:28:07 +0200
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To: "Dr. Martin Schuetz" <teomgs@theochem.uni-stuttgart.de>
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Subject: Re: CCL:(Fwd) DFT and H2O Dimer
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Hi Martin,

> DFT. In that sense I disagree with Dr. Schiffer, that the water dimer really is
> well described with DTF with the present standard gradient corrected
> functionals.

You call that not well described ? :

------------------------------------------------
			DFT-BP		Exp.
------------------------------------------------
O-O distance		2.98 A		2.98 A
angle of the H-bond	174 deg		174 deg
Binding energy		-20 kJ/mol	-22 kJ/mol
Frequencies, A		3671		3622
	A		1605		1600
	A		3779		3714
	D		3501		3548
	D		1588		1618
	D		3755		3698
	Hb		666		520
	Hb		396		320
	O-O		205		243
------------------------------------------------

The data are from the paper of Sprik, Hutter, and Parrinello.
And DFT-BP is an order of magnitude faster than MP2. That is not
to say, that MP2 doesn't make a very good job.

Ciao,
Heinz
-- 
Dr. Heinz Schiffer                  Phone ++49-69-305-2330                      
Hoechst Research & Technology       Fax   ++49-69-305-81162                     
Scientific Computing, G864          Email schiffer@h1tw0036.hoechst.com         
65926 Frankfurt am Main                   Schiffer@CRT.hoechst.com

From yar@polymer.chem.msu.su  Wed Oct  8 12:29:21 1997
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Date: Wed, 8 Oct 1997 17:54:51 +0000 (GMT)
From: Eugene Leitl <yar@polymer.chem.msu.su>
To: Computational Chemistry List <chemistry@www.ccl.net>
Subject: AMD K6 bugs numerics?
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Dear CCLers,

I've just built a K6/200 Linux box for visualization and some basic MD
purposes. (I am aware of its discrepancy between its integer and float
performance -- a PPro machine would have exploded our budget's limits, 
however.)

Unfortunately, my version of the chip (B9714) is almost certainly buggy
(only CPU IDs up B9730, and the C steppings are purported to be okay). 

Though there is a wealth of information on that bug on the web and usenet
newsgroups I am handicapped by having only email access.

- does the bug have any serious impact, particularly on MD runs?
- on a more general note, any (positive, negative) experiences with the 
  AMD K6 for numerical purposes?
- I took 64 MBytes SDRAM instead of EDO. Was this a smart move?

Thanks a lot,
Regards,
Eugene Leitl


From jsb2@camsoft.com  Wed Oct  8 14:29:24 1997
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Date: Wed, 8 Oct 97 13:40:05 EDT
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To: CHEMISTRY@www.ccl.net
Subject: Re: CCL:3D structure generator



>I am searching for a automatic 3D structure generator which accepts
>Smiles strings. Does anyone know of any utilities available that can do
>this (other than Corina or Concord).

ChemOffice for Windows will do this.  It's not set up to do it out of the 
box, but requires only takes a few lines of Visual Basic.

Jonathan Brecher
CambridgeSoft Corporation
jsb@camsoft.com

From godbout@chad.scs.uiuc.edu  Wed Oct  8 14:34:41 1997
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Date: Wed, 8 Oct 1997 12:18:13 -0500 (CDT)
From: Nathalie Godbout <godbout@chad.scs.uiuc.edu>
To: chemistry@www.ccl.net
cc: godbout@chad.scs.uiuc.edu
Subject: CCL: newzmat error message
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Hello,

  I have a problem with the newzmat Gaussian utility.
I have a pdb file that I want to convert into an
xyz format. The pdb file was created with Cerius. 
My command line is: newzmat -ipdb -oxyz filename.
I then get an error message which I often get:
 Unrecognizetomic symbol:
 0H6
 Error termid anation via Lnk1e.
Segmentation fault

I solve this problem by removing the numbers in
front of the atom type, as I usually do. This
time it doesn't work, I get:
An atom is on the line between two other atoms.
 Try reordering the atoms.
 NDone=  29 IJKL=  29   2   1   3 ALen= 2.18D-17 BLen= 1.00D+00
 Error termination via Lnk1e.
Segmentation fault

I tried the -coince option but that didn't help.

Does someone have an idea?

Many thanks,
Nathalie


 --------------------------------------------
| Nathalie Godbout                           |
| University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign |
| 600 S. Goodwin Av. Box 23.6                |
| Urbana, IL 61801                           |
 --------------------------------------------


From gmercier@mail.med.upenn.edu  Wed Oct  8 14:37:01 1997
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From: "Gustavo A. Mercier Jr" <gmercier@mail.med.upenn.edu>
Message-Id: <199710081825.OAA13466@mail.med.upenn.edu>
Subject: Re: CCL:DFT and H2O Dimer
To: chemistry@www.ccl.net
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 1997 14:25:20 -0400 (EDT)
In-Reply-To: <343B80C1.15FB@h1tw0036.hoechst.com> from "Dr. Heinz Schiffer" at Oct 8, 97 02:46:57 pm
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Hi!

> Wrong ! There is no dispersion at all in all local (LDA) or semi-local
> (i.e. so-called gradient corrected density functionals, like B, BP,
> BLYP, etc.) DFT methods. See the references by Becke, Pulay, and Sprik,
> which were always given on the CCL. There are some people ( like
> e.g. Baerends, and some other physicists, publishing in Phys. Rev.
> Lett. ) who are trying to construct an Exchange-Correlation energy
> functional, which includes dispersion. But as far as I know, it is very
> difficult and there are no results so far, which can be used in 
> quantum chemistry.

I would appreciate some clarification on this issue. I've been aware
of this for some time, but I am a bit confused.

The classical description of "dispersion" applies a model based on
induced-dipole/induced-dipole interactions. Through electrodynamic
interactions, the fluctuations (dynamic event) in the electronic
density between two interacting molecules will couple and reduce
the overall electrostatic energy.  This is in contrast to the polarization
that results from a electrostatic description.

Correlation is also explained in similar terms, dynamic fluctuations
in the electronic density. By definition, the correlation energy
is not included in the HF wavefunction, although exchange
repulsion does occur between electrons of equal spin. This implies
some correlated motion between these electrons which is absent
for electrons of opposite spins in HF. The missing part is included
through post-HF methods.

In both instances, coupling of the dynamic fluctuations of the charge
distribution is implied. For dispersion it is an intermolecular
effect; for correlation an intramolecular.

Yes, I am aware that the correlation energy has dynamic and static
components, but I simply can't recall the physical differences
between these.

Could anybody expound on:

Differences between dispersion and correlation?
Dynamic and static correlation?

A bit of info here would shed some light on the meaning
of the exchange - correlation functional. (BTW... under K-S
these functional do include that part of the kinetic energy
due to interaction between the electrons, point raised by
another CCL'er)

Thanks!

-- 
                                      ("`-/")_.-'"``-._
Gustavo A. Mercier,Jr.,MD,PhD         (. . `) -._    )-;-,_() 
Division of Nuclear Medicine          (v_,)'  _  )`-.\  ``-
Dept. of Radiology                    _;- _,-_/ / ((,'
University of Pennsylvania           ((,.-'  ((,/
3400 Spruce St.                  gmercier@mail.med.upenn.edu
Philadelphia, PA 19104         215-662-3069/3091 fax: 215-349-5843



From rami.reddy@gensia.com  Wed Oct  8 16:29:22 1997
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To: chemistry@www.ccl.net
Subject: Solubility Predictions


Dear CCLers,

I am looking for programs which calculate the solubility of small organic 
molecules. Any reference is highly appreciated.
 
 Thanx in advance
 M. Rami Reddy
 Email: reddy@gensia.com


From roberson@kemibm.kemi.aau.dk  Wed Oct  8 16:39:14 1997
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To: CHEMISTRY@www.ccl.net
Subject: SGI Octane Redux



Wise Ones,

    Thank you all for your kind advice about what machine to purchase.
In the end we settled on a two-processor workstation with 512 Meg RAM 
and 9 gig disk for each processor, having been warned that the standard
package might be inadequate.

						Mark


From gmercier@mail.med.upenn.edu  Wed Oct  8 17:29:21 1997
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From: "Gustavo A. Mercier Jr" <gmercier@mail.med.upenn.edu>
Message-Id: <199710082042.QAA16089@mail.med.upenn.edu>
Subject: Dispersion/Correlation
To: CHEMISTRY@www.ccl.net
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 Hi!
 
 > Wrong ! There is no dispersion at all in all local (LDA) or semi-local
 > (i.e. so-called gradient corrected density functionals, like B, BP,
 > BLYP, etc.) DFT methods. See the references by Becke, Pulay, and Sprik,
 > which were always given on the CCL. There are some people ( like
 > e.g. Baerends, and some other physicists, publishing in Phys. Rev.
 > Lett. ) who are trying to construct an Exchange-Correlation energy
 > functional, which includes dispersion. But as far as I know, it is very
 > difficult and there are no results so far, which can be used in 
 > quantum chemistry.
 
 I would appreciate some clarification on this issue. I've been aware
 of this for some time, but I am a bit confused.
 
 The classical description of "dispersion" applies a model based on
 induced-dipole/induced-dipole interactions. Through electrodynamic
 interactions, the fluctuations (dynamic event) in the electronic
 density between two interacting molecules will couple and reduce
 the overall electrostatic energy.  This is in contrast to the polarization
 that results from a electrostatic description.
 
 Correlation is also explained in similar terms, dynamic fluctuations
 in the electronic density. By definition, the correlation energy
 is not included in the HF wavefunction, although exchange
 repulsion does occur between electrons of equal spin. This implies
 some correlated motion between these electrons which is absent
 for electrons of opposite spins in HF. The missing part is included
 through post-HF methods.
 
 In both instances, coupling of the dynamic fluctuations of the charge
 distribution is implied. For dispersion it is an intermolecular
 effect; for correlation an intramolecular.
 
 Yes, I am aware that the correlation energy has dynamic and static
 components, but I simply can't recall the physical differences
 between these.
 
 Could anybody expound on:
 
 Differences between dispersion and correlation?
 Dynamic and static correlation?
 
 A bit of info here would shed some light on the meaning
 of the exchange - correlation functional. (BTW... under K-S
 these functional do include that part of the kinetic energy
 due to interaction between the electrons, point raised by
 another CCL'er)
 
 Thanks!

-- 
                                      ("`-/")_.-'"``-._
Gustavo A. Mercier,Jr.,MD,PhD         (. . `) -._    )-;-,_() 
Division of Nuclear Medicine          (v_,)'  _  )`-.\  ``-
Dept. of Radiology                    _;- _,-_/ / ((,'
University of Pennsylvania           ((,.-'  ((,/
3400 Spruce St.                  gmercier@mail.med.upenn.edu
Philadelphia, PA 19104         215-662-3069/3091 fax: 215-349-5843



From korkin@qtp.ufl.edu  Wed Oct  8 18:29:23 1997
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Date: Wed, 8 Oct 1997 17:55:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: Anatoli Korkin <korkin@qtp.ufl.edu>
Reply-To: Anatoli Korkin <korkin@qtp.ufl.edu>
Subject: reaction of hydroxyl with alkanes
To: chemistry@www.ccl.net
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Dear CCLers,

Is anyone familiar with recent (1994-97) theoretical and experimental
studies of hydrogen abstraction from (substituted) alkanes by hydroxyl,
e.g RCH2-H + OH. -> RCH2. + H2O.

Thank you for info,

Anatoli

------------------------------------------------
My new mailing address starting from November 10:

	Dr. Anatoli A. Korkin
	Motorola Inc.,
	2200 W. Broadway Road,
	M/S M350
	Mesa, AZ-85202.



From wriggers@ks.uiuc.edu  Wed Oct  8 18:54:56 1997
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From: Willy Wriggers <wriggers@ks.uiuc.edu>
Date: Wed,  8 Oct 97 16:35:15 -0500
To: chemistry@www.ccl.net
Subject: isosurfaces in volumetric data


Hi,

I'm looking for a free implementation (preferably in c) of an  
algorithm that renders isosurfaces of 3D data on a grid.

One example would be the Marching Cubes algorithm by Lorensen and  
Cline, but any other method that generates triangles and  
corresponding surface normals is welcome, too.

Thanks.

Willy Wriggers
_______________________________________________
wriggers@uiuc.edu		 (NeXT-mail OK)

Willy R. Wriggers
Theoretical Biophysics Group
Beckman Institute
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
405 North Mathews Avenue
Urbana, IL 61801, USA

Telephone (217) 244-1612
Telefax (217) 244-6078
Web Site: http://www.ks.uiuc.edu/~wriggers/
_______________________________________________

From fgonzale@lauca.usach.cl  Wed Oct  8 20:29:23 1997
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Date: Wed, 8 Oct 1997 19:58:35 -0400 (CST)
From: Fdo Danilo Gonzalez Nilo <fgonzale@lauca.usach.cl>
To: chemistry@www.ccl.net
Subject: G94 on LINUX
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91.971008194805.24580A-100000@lauca.usach.cl>
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Hi all!

	I like to install Gaussian94 on a Pentium with LINUX, my questions are:

- Does any body know if GaussView run on LINUX?
- What is the recommended hardware for running G94 on LINUX?
- Is it necesary another commercial program for running G94 on LINUX?

Thanks a Lot!!

Fernando Danilo Gonzalez N.           

University of Santiago de Chile
Faculty of Chemistry and Biology, Computational Chemistry Lab.         
Casilla 40, Correo 33, Santiago, Chile      Fono: (562) 681 2575 Anexo:799
E-mail : fgonzale@lauca.usach.cl            Fax : (562) 681 2108           
URL    : http://quimbio.usach.cl/~danilo/
**************************************************************************


