From owner-chemistry@ccl.net Thu Aug 27 16:02:01 2009 From: "Johannes Johansson johjo76++gmail.com" To: CCL Subject: CCL: And now something completely different! Message-Id: <-40095-090827153355-16686-aaDUj9UZEfjEkzLElTdzkQ^-^server.ccl.net> X-Original-From: Johannes Johansson Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd356c833ee7d047224343a Date: Thu, 27 Aug 2009 21:02:07 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Sent to CCL by: Johannes Johansson [johjo76+/-gmail.com] --000e0cd356c833ee7d047224343a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To those who are following the (more or less useful) discussion of the YouTube clip on the interaction of matter and light. There is a thesis in Physics Pedagogics, published in 2007 at Uppsala University, Sweden. It deals with WHAT students of chemistry and physics find most difficult in QM (at different levels) and it also tries to track the reasons for this difficulties and misunderstandings. ONE of the conclusions is that the teaching of simplified models such as the pictorial Bohr atom causes difficulties also for students at higher levels. This is NOT a personal statement from me, just some information for those who are interested in this issue, so please do not give me any replies. If you are interested, please see: http://uu.diva-portal.org/smash/record.jsf?searchId=3D1&pid=3Ddiva2:116635 or http://johanfalk.net/sites/default/files/Falk_2007_licentiate%20thesis.pdf Kind regards/Johannes 2009/8/27 Mihaly Mezei Mihaly.Mezei]*[mssm.edu > > Sent to CCL by: Mihaly Mezei [Mihaly.Mezei]_[mssm.edu] > > While I liked your movie, I dont believe that this is a good impressio= n > to > > convey to new or prospective students. It only sets them up for > > inevitable disappointment when they find out that doing and learning > > science is not really fun, but tedious, hard and often boring work (no > one who ever > > debugged parallel code could disagree...) I don't want to depreciate my > > own profession, because obviously the results of doing research are > > worth every bit of effort. As an analogy, the Golden Gate Bridge > > surely is impressive, but I don't think it was fun to build. > > I agree with Dr. Steinbrecher. > > Also, I would like to point out that the "fun" we are having when doing > science (and we do) is very different from the "fun" of, say, attending a > rock concert. To me, the "fun" is when after a tedious derivation, the pe= sky > higher order terms cancel and I end up with a closed form result. Or, whe= n > after weeks of coding, debugging and testing, an idea I had turns out to = be > correct. Or, after half an hour of head scratching, I manage to solve a > Sudoku labeled 'hard'. Maybe the closest analogy would be a strenuous hi= ke > to a spot with spectacular view. I think that this is the idea of fun tha= t > we have to convey to the future generation. > > Mihaly Mezei > > Department of Structural and Chemical Biology, Mount Sinai School of > Medicine, NYU > Voice: (212) 659-5475 Fax: (212) 849-2456 > WWW (MSSM home): > http://www.mountsinai.org/Find%20A%20Faculty/profile.do?id=3D000007250000= 1497192632 > WWW (Lab home - software, publications): http://inka.mssm.edu/~mezei > WWW (Department): http://atlas.physbio.mssm.edu > > > > -=3D This is automatically added to each message by the mailing script = =3D-> > > --=20 Adam Johannes Johansson Ph.D., M.Sc. Institut f=C3=BCr Organische Chemie RWTH Aachen University Landoltweg 1 52056 Aachen Germany Cell phone:0708178487 E-mail:johjo76_-_gmail.com Research web page:www.physto.se/~johjo --000e0cd356c833ee7d047224343a Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To those who are following the (more or less useful) discussion of the YouT= ube clip on the interaction of matter and light. There is a thesis in Physi= cs Pedagogics, published in 2007 at Uppsala University, Sweden. It deals wi= th WHAT=C2=A0<= /span>students of chemistry and physics find most difficult in QM (at diffe= rent levels) and it also tries to track the reasons for this difficulties a= nd misunderstandings. ONE of the conclusions is that the teaching of simpli= fied models such as the pictorial Bohr atom causes difficulties also for st= udents at higher levels. This is NOT a personal statement from me, just som= e information for those who are interested in this issue, so please do not = give me any replies. If you are interested, please see:


or

Kind regards/Johannes




2009/8/27 Mihaly Mezei Mihaly.Mezei]*[mssm.edu= <owner= -chemistry_-_ccl.net>

Sent to CCL by: Mihaly Mezei [Mihaly.Mezei]_[mssm.edu]
> While I liked your movie, I dont believe that this is a good =C2=A0imp= ression to
> convey to new or prospective students. It only sets them up for
> inevitable disappointment when they find out that doing and learning > science is not really fun, but tedious, hard and often boring work (no= one who ever
> debugged parallel code could disagree...) I don't want to deprecia= te my
> own profession, because obviously the results of doing research are > worth every bit of effort. As an analogy, the Golden Gate Bridge
> surely is impressive, but I don't think it was fun to build.

I agree with Dr. Steinbrecher.

Also, I would like to point out that the "fun" we are having when= doing science (and we do) is very different from the "fun" of, s= ay, attending a rock concert. To me, the "fun" is when after a te= dious derivation, the pesky higher order terms cancel and I end up with a c= losed form result. Or, when after weeks of coding, debugging and testing, a= n idea I had turns out to be correct. Or, after half an hour of head scratc= hing, I manage to solve a Sudoku labeled 'hard'. =C2=A0Maybe the cl= osest analogy would be a strenuous hike to a spot with spectacular view. I = think that this is the idea of fun that we have to convey to the future gen= eration.

Mihaly Mezei

Department of Structural and Chemical Biology, Mount Sinai School of Medici= ne, NYU
Voice: =C2=A0(212) 659-5475 =C2=A0 Fax: (212) 849-2456
WWW (MSSM home): http://www.mountsin= ai.org/Find%20A%20Faculty/profile.do?id=3D0000072500001497192632
WWW (Lab home - software, publications): http://inka.mssm.edu/~mezei
WWW (Department): http://atlas.physbio.mssm.edu



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--
Adam Johannes Johansson=
Ph.D., M.Sc.
Institut f=C3=BCr Organische Chemie
RWTH Aachen Univ= ersity
Landoltweg 1
52056 Aachen
Germany
Cell phone:0708178487<= br> E-mail:johjo76_-_gmail.com<= br>Research web page:www.physto.se/= ~johjo

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